garrick lee (goner4sure@yahoo.com)
Mon, 19 Feb 2001 05:56:13 -0800 (PST)


er, this is my last post on this thread, and i hope to
make peace with it.

ez8, my condolences for what you and your family
suffered at the hands of the "commies". i won't say
i "know how you feel", because i don't (you are right
however, in saying that the americans were to us, what
the "commies" were to you...that and probably much
worse). however, don't presume to say that we don't
know what communism is and what communists are like,
because we have our own experiences with the "commies"
or "damn reds" or whatever derogatory term you feel
comfortable using.

what you are doing is generalizing and lumping
together all communists into one homogeous whole, and
that's clearly and undeniably erroneous. it would be
akin to saying that all christians are evil for the
atrocities committed by the crusaders in the dark
ages. it would be akin to saying that all moslems are
evil for the terrorism that many extremist factions
perpetrate on the world (in the name of allah, or so
they claim). please take a step back and re-examine
your own values -- your bitterness is quite extreme
and understandable, but doesn't solve anything. it
won't help you get on with life. keep holding on to
it and your other extreme biases, and you'll
self-destruct. and you're only 17. you'll probably
think i'm wrong, or probably hate me for saying these
things, or probably accuse me of trying to
psychoanalyze you. i don't really care. this is all
i have to say about it -- a lot of us are older than
you, and have had our fair share of shit happening to
us and our families. we know what we're talking
about, and i'm not patronizing you by saying these
things.

at any rate, to tie it in with gundam...i would have
thought that simply watching gundam would have shown
you (and all of us) the wrongness and futility of
thinking in "us vs. them" (democracy vs. "commies")
mentality by crystallizing in a simple-to-understand
digest the story of real human tragedy -- that many
people are caught up in conflicts they don't want to
be in and they don't understand because of the games
of the powers that be (federation and the, er, dukes
of zeon in gundam's case...in real world history, you
can figure it out yourself). whatever faults the
communists have, it's not simply because they're
communists. it's because they're pawns. if you must
hate, then at least target your hatred to the ones
responsible for the crimes against humanity. when you
figure out who it is to blame and WHY, you'll figure
that it's the same thing all over the world, all over
history, no matter what the sociopolitical ideology --
democracy, parliament, oligarchy, monarchy,
dictatorship. that's all i was trying to say in the
other post, and that's all i'm saying.

good day.

and now, back to gundam.

-garr

--- Gundam EZEight <rx_79g_ez_8@yahoo.com> wrote:
> you sound like some one in vn would say right now.
> you
> feel exactly the way i do. the americans to you is
> like the commies in my country, except for the fact
> that US isn't ruling over you with an iron fist.
> --- Franz G Co <darkholy@saintly.com> wrote:
> > ------Original Message------
> > From: Gundam EZEight <rx_79g_ez_8@yahoo.com>
> > To: gundam@aeug.org
> > Sent: February 19, 2001 4:56:39 AM GMT
> > Subject: Re: [gundam] Next PG
> >
> > When the Americans came during WWII to "liberate"
> > us, half of the
> > archipalego had been liberated by the Hukbalahap
> > (Hukbo Laban sa mga Hapon -
> > Troop Against the Japanese), who by chance hppened
> > to be communists. The
> > Americans then proceeded to "liberate" us from our
> > own countrymen who had
> > fought so hard for independence.
> >
> > There's something called economic imperialism
> which
> > is the exact thing
> > happening here. The Amreicanns control the market
> > even if we are supposedly
> > independent. Why do youthink the US want's free
> > trade so much, so that they
> > can penetrate other markets more easily. This
> would
> > be fine if there was
> > perfect competition (economically speeking)
> however
> > the American (and other)
> > companies tend to be bigger than local companies
> > therefore competition in
> > unequal.
> >
> > >the philippines did not start out to be
> communists
> > >though. that's the difference. but i can see that
> > >filipinos are much better off than the viets
> right
> > now
> > >anywayz. considering the fact that a Gundam can
> > cost
> > >an average vietnamese a whole month's salary, i
> > don't
> > >think US economic involvement would be all that
> > bad.
> > --- Franz G Co <darkholy@saintly.com> wrote:
> > > Yet look at us - the Philippines. Thanks to the
> > US
> > > "educating" us for
> > > independence we're just as dependent of the US
> > > economy for ours. This same
> > > thing woulod have happened to Vietnam, it
> woul've
> > > been another economic
> > > slave of the United States.
> > >
> > > ------Original Message------
> > > From: Gundam EZEight <rx_79g_ez_8@yahoo.com>
> > > To: gundam@aeug.org
> > > Sent: February 19, 2001 4:17:18 AM GMT
> > > Subject: Re: [gundam] Next PG
> > >
> > >
> > > what the hell are you? a commie?
> > > if the US had stayed in a while longer, Vietnam
> > > would
> > > not be lost to the commies. if Johnson (?) had
> NOT
> > > carpet bombed Vietnam but instead give sometime
> > > figuring out guerilla warfare, the US would have
> > > won,
> > > and Vietnam will be truly independent. what i
> see
> > in
> > > vietnam right now is scary: everyone wants to be
> > > foreign. everyone thinks korean things are
> better
> > > than
> > > vietnamese things. i don't blame them really,
> > > because
> > > the things the vietnamese can make are crap
> mainly
> > > due
> > > to the fact that commies are in control.
> > > no form of government is truly perfect, but
> > > democracy
> > > is the best form of government right now. i
> > > certainly
> > > don't want commies running this country.
> > > --- garrick lee <goner4sure@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- DuckFlesh@aol.com wrote:
> > > > > In a message dated 2/18/01 8:43:53 PM
> Central
> > > > > Standard Time,
> > > > > rx_79g_ez_8@yahoo.com writes:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > >communists and what they did to us. i'm
> > just
> > > > > saying<
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Thats Just wrong. China's communist two. And
> > > Cuba,
> > > > > and North Korea. I guess
> > > > > every one there is inferior because you
> don't
> > > like
> > > > > communists. ohy... this
> > > > > serious attitude isn't me... I have to start
> a
> > > > flame
> > > > > war, fast!
> > > >
> > > > uhm....i find myself agreeing with duckflesh,
> > and
> > > > that's scary. :P
> > > >
> > > > not all chinese (*ahem cough harrumph*) are
> > > > communists, not all vietnamese are communists,
> > not
> > > > all
> > > > koreans are communists, etc. etc., not all
> > germans
> > > > are
> > > > nazis, you get the idea.
> > > >
> > > > ultimately, not all communists are bad guys (i
> > > take
> > > > it
> > > > gundamez8 is referring to the vietnam war? if
> > so,
> > > > you
> > > > DO know that US butted in in the first place,
> > and
> > > > the
> > > > domino effect theory of the evils of communism
> > has
> > > > remained effectively a theory ?). you may
> > dislike
> > > > communISM, but please refrain from blanket
> > > > statements
> > > > regarding communISTS.
> > > >
> > > > communists = bad guys --> that's just the
> > naive,
> > > > and
> > > > monochrome picture perfect scenario that the
> > > > self-proclaimed champion of democracy (USA)
> > wants
> > > to
> > > > paint. all the while, everyone ignores the
> > > failings
> > > > of democracy, which is quite possibly one of
> the
> > > > dumbest (though at least humane) forms of
> > > government
> > > > ever.
> > > > then again, i'll be damned if machiavelli is
> > > right.
> > > > i
> > > > refuse to accept that too.
> > > >
> > > > -garr
> > > >
> > > >
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2.0b3 on Mon Feb 19 2001 - 22:56:25 JST