Alfred Urrutia (
Wed, 26 May 1999 14:18:28 -0700 (PDT)

On May 26, 4:22pm, wasted bandwidth discussing:
> Subject: Re: [WOT] was Re: [gundam] New Turn A episode Summary

> That's a totally unfair question. If TPM wasn't Star Wars, it would be a
> totally different movie with totally different plots and story. That question
> doesn't even count.

Yes it does. Do you know why? Because before the movie "Star Wars" came
out, there was *no Star Wars universe or background to compare it to*. It
was judged as just a movie, *not* a Star Wars movie. And it's a damn good
movie. So I guess what I'm asking is, if "The Phantom Menace" were the first
movie made instead of the fourth one made by Lucas would you cut it as much
slack? With no Star Wars mythology to hook it to and no expectations based
on previous movies? Judge as a movie unto itself, not as part of a series
of your favorite movies. Why do you resist doing this? Maybe because you
must concede more flaws in it?

Since you seem to give anything Lucas makes all the benefit of the doubt
just because it's in the Star Wars universe then I have four words for you -
"Star Wars Christmas Special". Yes, it's Lucas' vision. It has Luke, Han,
Leia and Chewie in it. You must then insist that it is as spectacular as
everything else. Too childish? Naw, couldn't be. Life Day on the Wookie
home world. Brilliant. Jefferson Starship, Harvey Corman and Bea Arthur
are part of the Star Wars universe. How many times have you demanded to
play Art Carney's character in a Star Wars RPG? Chewie's dad? Funny how
their action figures were never made. So, tell me honestly, without
embarrassment, how absolutely amazing that hunk of shit is, too. It must
be, it says "Star Wars" on it.

Now, I'm not saying that "Phantom Menace" is anywhere near as unwatchable as
that eyesore (Lucas went out of his way to try and destroy every copy of that
hell), I'm saying it's possible for Lucas to hit below the mark. I'll say it
again. It's possible for Lucas to hit below the mark. And he did. His
"below the mark" is better than most directors' good movies but it's still
below the mark.

> They didn't wipe out the droids, the control ship blew up. Again, its unfair
> to compare Gundam to Star Wars, that's like comparing cars to spaceships. The
> Gungans are only a diviserion, they had no intentions of a dug in, long term
> battle.

Ok, I'll type slower. Sure, they'll only there to divert the Federation army,
get them out of the city. But they and the droid army's tactics were much
worse than any battle in the other movies. Any half decent army wouldn't
have *needed* to take out the command ship, they could have taken them on the
ground. My point is if they weren't written to be so boring *they* could
have beaten the droid army because those droids are worthless in a fight and
the Gungans had more than enough weapons to take them out while they were
still unloading.

I'm not comparing Gundam to Star Wars, I'm asking you if you would accept
such childish tactics in a Gundam series *just because* it was Gundam and
not some other anime. As hard as you try to wiggle out of the question I'll
keep you on it.

> Its okay to talk about that stuff in Gundam on this ML. Its okay to do the
> same thing about SW, but, do it in an SW ML. I was going to stay out of this
> discussion, but I had to finally say something now and in my earlier posts.
> Its okay to talk about lousy weapons and tactics, but it doesn't have to turn
> into an every minor flaw hunt.

I already explained what I felt was minor and what was glaring. This is
glaring. Anakin's child friend having braces is minor. And I didn't start
this debate on this mailing list. But I'll finish it if you like. Funny
how once the opinions deviate too far from yours that you invoke the Mailing
List Topic law. Can't hide from me there.

> ISo what do you want, a super gritty Star Wars movie thats only for adults
> and teenagers? Is that what you mean by TPM being "soft'? I don't view Qui
> Gon Jinn getting stabbed by Darth Maul as "soft" at all.

Since when does 'not childish' = 'super gritty'?

The movie is soft. Many parts of it are great, though, yes. I already listed
those. No, it doesn't have to be so gritty as that. It's set when everything
was relatively calm, before the Empire. It shouldn't be this damn childish,
though. Thank god he's not directing episodes 2 and 3. I plan on seeing
"Phantom Menace" again. I'm just not going to agree that it's as great as the
other three. It ain't.

Did you like the book "Starship Troopers"? How about the movie?

Did you like the movies "Alien" and "Aliens"? How about parts 3 and 4?

Just because a movie is connected to something you like doesn't guarantee
it will be great. Judge "Phantom Menace" on its own merits.


"Besides, you'd have to have 20 different encryptions for 'dick' or
 they'd crack it in a day."

- Shannan, on encryption difficulties

Alfred Urrutia - Disney FA - 818.526.3338 - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- - Gundam Mailing List Archives are available at

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